|
Jeremy Falcon wrote: Just so we're on the same page, I don't define "hate speech" as not using someone's pronouns. Not sure who you consider a Nazi btw, assuming we're intelligent enough to not trust the media to tell us who is.
Deliberately setting out to not use someone's pronouns is unkind.. Hate speech is pouring hate on someone.. Nazism is agreeing with Hitler. "First they came for the socialists". In fact they first came for gays and trans kids, it's just that no one minded much. And yeah, the modern right are so stupid, they think Nazis were left wing
Jeremy Falcon wrote: Well, to be fair... that is racist. Not that I think people should be censored at all as I believe in freedom of speech, mind you.
I've never said I hate white men, I am one. I'm more saying I've spoken against sexism and rape and got bans
And yeah look, I'd prefer even the views I hate to be freely spoken, then they can be discussed and everyone knows where they stand
Jeremy Falcon wrote: At least we agree on this.  The question is... who's to blame for this? Please don't say Trump though; we're supposed to be smarter than the brainwashing TV. I think a lot of this stems from us spending less time outside and talking to other humans, as simple as that may seem.
Well, trump has given voice to modern Fascism obviously. He's enabled hate and made it ok. But he's not to blame for this.. It's the internet . People in other countries can easily call my phone and live outside the law, or try to approach me on the internet. It's a failure of law to keep up with technology.
Jeremy Falcon wrote: I've blocked people before that were just looking to argue, and that's like a form a banning I guess. But for people that can hold a conversation, it only takes humanity backwards.
I block people to just stay on social media. If I politely address their claim that my children should be harmed for existing, I get a ban
|
|
|
|
|
Christian Graus wrote: Deliberately setting out to not use someone's pronouns is unkind
So, if I identify as a tree and demand you refer to me as tree/trunk and you refuse because it's nonsense... Does that make you unkind to think I'm mentally ill?
Christian Graus wrote: And yeah, the modern right are so stupid, they think Nazis were left wing
Sorry buddy, we're just going to have to disagree on this one. It is the Left acting more like Nazis than the Right man. We'll probably never agree on that. But, at least we can agree on free speech being a good thing. 
Christian Graus wrote: I've never said I hate white men, I am one. I'm more saying I've spoken against sexism and rape and got bans
I think I misread that then. Unfortunately, well you know how the world is right now. We're all too used to jumping the gun these days. FWIW, I think dudes can be stupid too. I mean so can women, but guys are creepier about their desires IMO. So, we agree on this too. 
Christian Graus wrote: Well, trump has given voice to modern Fascism obviously. He's enabled hate and made it ok
We're going to strongly disagree on this one man. Very strongly. He embodies the American spirit. Does he lack social tact? Sure. But, he's the best thing that's happened in a long while. Weak people can't handle the truth about their shortcomings. They get butthurt too easy. Nothing more. Nothing less. We need more of him and a lot less of the corrupt media brainwashing people while letting the sneaky ones get off clean.
Christian Graus wrote: People in other countries can easily call my phone and live outside the law, or try to approach me on the internet. It's a failure of law to keep up with technology.
Side note, dunno we should have a global law though. That's too much power for any single entity. It may sound nice, but would be detrimental in the long run.
Christian Graus wrote: I block people to just stay on social media. If I politely address their claim that my children should be harmed for existing, I get a ban
I block peeps too. It's the new thing. Not sure what you mean by your kids being harmed, but Left or Right anyone that hurts a kid is a bad person. Not sure what kinda nutjob would suggest otherwise, but I'm sure they're out there.
Anywho, it's good to see you again man. Despite the whole world hating each other right now. Can we call this a win that we at least agree censorship/banning is bad?
Jeremy Falcon
|
|
|
|
|
Jeremy Falcon wrote: So, if I identify as a tree and demand you refer to me as tree/trunk and you refuse because it's nonsense... Does that make you unkind to think I'm mentally ill?
People have genders. People have pronouns. People are not trees. If you talk to someone, they have a name and a pronoun. Regardless of your sexual insecurity, a decision to use someone's preferred pronoun revolves around manners. Every mental health professional agrees being trans is not a mental illness and every biologist agrees sex and gender are spectrums (ignoring the binary of body parts) and being trans is normal
Jeremy Falcon wrote: It is the Left acting more like Nazis than the Right man
The issue here is one of education. Nazis were far right wing. The left might not agree with the right. The left might form loose groups to use force to stop right wing violence. But being violent is not 'being a Nazi'. If it was, Stalin was a Nazi and not the person who defeated the Nazis.
Jeremy Falcon wrote: FWIW, I think dudes can be stupid too. I mean so can women, but guys are creepier about their desires IMO. So, we agree on this too.
I'm in singles groups and it's actually sad watching genuinely lonely and probably decent men trying to use the Andrew Tate playbook to try to get laid. While those men call me a beta and so on, I am just kind to people. I was pushed into an open marriage and tons of women were interested in me, because I was not a prick
So I think that society has let down men as well as women, for sure
Jeremy Falcon wrote: He embodies the American spirit.
I agree the USA was always somewhat fascist, and certainly a global empire. Trump was the dictionary definition of fascism. MAGA is dictionary definition fascism, a promise to return to a mythical past that never was real, by abandoning modern values.
Trump destroyed the credibility of the USA on the world stage. Most Australians would favour having no security ties with the USA if he's president again.
Jeremy Falcon wrote: Side note, dunno we should have a global law though. That's too much power for any single entity. It may sound nice, but would be detrimental in the long run.
Well, yeah, there's no simple solution to this, but that's still what the issue is. The ease of people out of reach of my laws, to try to make contact with me.
Jeremy Falcon wrote: Not sure what you mean by your kids being harmed, but Left or Right anyone that hurts a kid is a bad person. Not sure what kinda nutjob would suggest otherwise, but I'm sure they're out there.
In the first instance a far right gang stalked and threatened to kill my kids and still harass me online, for being kind to refugees. In the second, the right wing obsession with laws to deny trans kids medicine and support will kill children
Jeremy Falcon wrote: Anywho, it's good to see you again man. Despite the whole world hating each other right now. Can we call this a win that we at least agree censorship/banning is bad?
Facebook wants everyone on their platform to feel safe, which means 'never challenged'. I disagree. It's good to see you again, too, and I am happy to know and talk to people who disagree with me. I doubt I would ever agree with you 100% but it's good to be exposed to other world views and not impossible I might learn something
|
|
|
|
|
Christian Graus wrote: People have genders. People have pronouns. People are not trees. If you talk to someone, they have a name and a pronoun. Regardless of your sexual insecurity, a decision to use someone's preferred pronoun revolves around manners. Every mental health professional agrees being trans is not a mental illness and every biologist agrees sex and gender are spectrums (ignoring the binary of body parts) and being trans is normal
That's just it though, this has nothing to do with my sexual insecurity. I promise I've been around the blook way more than most. I do not agree with the philosophy at all that a man can become a woman. He can be girly and that's cool, but it doesn't make him an actual woman. The false credibility of fake professors means nothing. College has gone to crap. It's a joke. It's insanity IMO. This is something no amount of banter will convince me of. However, the Left is trying to make it illegal for me to not use the "correct" pronouns. Surely, any sensible person would be against that, even if we don't agree.
Christian Graus wrote: The issue here is one of education. Nazis were far right wing. The left might not agree with the right. The left might form loose groups to use force to stop right wing violence. But being violent is not 'being a Nazi'. If it was, Stalin was a Nazi and not the person who defeated the Nazis.
Don't agree man. It's not the Right forcing this newfangled crap down people's throat. It's the Left. 20 years ago, everyone knew where to go pee. This is a Left-wing movement backed by violence. Not sure why the hatred is being justified.
Christian Graus wrote: I'm in singles groups and it's actually sad watching genuinely lonely and probably decent men trying to use the Andrew Tate playbook to try to get laid.
Dude's are gonna be dumb. FYI, I don't hate Andrew Tate at all. He's a fool, but he says a lot of good stuff too. Doesn't mean I buy into his overgrown child philosophy though, any mature man sees right through it. But, he's not evil either. I say that knowing I could be full wrong. None of us really know his private life. Just going off what I see on YouTube.
Christian Graus wrote: While those men call me a beta and so on, I am just kind to people. I was pushed into an open marriage and tons of women were interested in me, because I was not a prick
Real talk man. Women want a guy to treat them nice, but they don't want a pushover either. No woman wants that. She wants to feel her man is strong and can protect her. Doesn't mean you have treat her poorly, but it also means women want a man to have a backbone and say what they mean. It's impossible to have a real connection otherwise - which is what women really want. Dumb guys mistake this for being an ahole, which it's not. But a chick would rather an ahole than a pushover.
Christian Graus wrote: In the first instance a far right gang stalked and threatened to kill my kids and still harass me online, for being kind to refugees. In the second, the right wing obsession with laws to deny trans kids medicine and support will kill children
Well, sorry to hear they're being harassed man. Children should never have to take the burden of adults being... well... silly. No matter what you know. As far as the second point, it comes back to the fundamental disagreement. It's not lifesaving anything. It's the mutilation of children while they're still naive enough to believe anything an adult tells them. You can't vote, but you can get an operation without parental consent? They're kids. For all they know Santa is real and they're Captain Crunch. We'll most likely never agree on this, but I don't think it's wrong to say kids have no idea what they want. It's the adults pushing an agenda on them. So, there's no harm in waiting until they're old enough to really decided what they want... not what the parents tell them to want.
Christian Graus wrote: I agree the USA was always somewhat fascist, and certainly a global empire. Trump was the dictionary definition of fascism. MAGA is dictionary definition fascism, a promise to return to a mythical past that never was real, by abandoning modern values.
Trump destroyed the credibility of the USA on the world stage. Most Australians would favour having no security ties with the USA if he's president again.
We just 100% will not agree on Trump. And no CP post is gonna change that. My only ask is that you form your opinion on him from something besides the media. The media is corrupt and pure evil.
Christian Graus wrote: Facebook wants everyone on their platform to feel safe, which means 'never challenged'. I disagree. It's good to see you again, too, and I am happy to know and talk to people who disagree with me. I doubt I would ever agree with you 100% but it's good to be exposed to other world views and not impossible I might learn something
100% man and totally agree. No matter what we feel about humanity right now, freedom of speech is the only thing that will take us forward. Without that, crap will just get worse.
Jeremy Falcon
modified 3-Nov-23 13:06pm.
|
|
|
|
|
Jeremy Falcon wrote: t's the mutilation of children while they're still naive enough to believe anything an adult tells them. You can't vote, but you can get an operation without parental consent?
Bingo.
I'm deleting the rest to focus on this. Genital surgery is NEVER allowed for children. But because you live in right wing echo chambers, you think that's what gender affirming care is, so you support ending gender affirming care, which doesn't end something we never did, but does end mental support and medication that is life saving.
The fact you think trans kids are getting operations disqualifies you from an opinion, I am sorry. You are listening to echo chambers and have never really looked into it
|
|
|
|
|
Christian Graus wrote: The fact you think trans kids are getting operations disqualifies you from an opinion, I am sorry. You are listening to echo chambers and have never really looked into it
Sure I am, but aren't we all? People that hate Trump are doing the same thing. Right or wrong, lies or not, I have seen documentaries suggesting otherwise, over in the US though. Then again, it's the media, so you never know. I do at least try and stay independent, but it's harder and harder to do these days ya know.
That being said, that's good to know. IMO a child should not be allowed to make life changing choices like that. They can't drink, smoke, vote, drive and still eat their boogers. They're kids ya know. They'll change anything on a whim.
I will have to say though, I still disagree with the premise of pretending someone is a boy or girl just because they feel like it. Peeps wanna make it sound like that means a person homophobic, but nope, I love some gay dudes (in a friendly way). It's two diff things. Dunno why we have this all or none concept going on these days.
There are girly men and manly women. That doesn't mean they're actually the opposite sex. I realize peeps changed the meaning of the word gender and that's fine. But the two terms are still being conflated. Having a feminine "gender" as a dude doesn't make you a woman. It means you're still a feminine dude. To me, saying otherwise demeans women and the female experience. It's an insult to women to say peeing in women's bathrooms is all it takes to be a woman.
Freud would have a field day if he were alive. He always said women had peepee envy. These days apparently, it's the dudes who have never had a masculine influence (not Andrew Tate ) who envy not having a peepee.
Jeremy Falcon
|
|
|
|
|
Jeremy Falcon wrote: Sure I am, but aren't we all? People that hate Trump are doing the same thing. Right or wrong, lies or not, I have seen documentaries suggesting otherwise, over in the US though. Then again, it's the media, so you never know. I do at least try and stay independent, but it's harder and harder to do these days ya know.
I hate Trump for things he said and did. The crimes that are documented are secondary. Also, the things his fans say and do, the worst people on earth
Jeremy Falcon wrote: IMO a child should not be allowed to make life changing choices like that.
To reiterate, we don't allow surgery on kids. The drugs we give them are not permanent. If a 6 year old 'transitions' it means she is allowed to wear a dress and be called Susan. We are doing nothing permanent to kids
Jeremy Falcon wrote: I still disagree with the premise of pretending someone is a boy or girl just because they feel like it.
Then you disagree with being kind to people. No other way to say it
Jeremy Falcon wrote: Peeps wanna make it sound like that means a person homophobic,
No, it's transphobic. Trans is not a sexuality
Jeremy Falcon wrote: There are girly men and manly women. That doesn't mean they're actually the opposite sex.
No one thinks tomboys are trans. It's funny to me the right have come on board with 'gender roles are bullshit' but as a way to oppose trans people
Jeremy Falcon wrote: I realize peeps changed the meaning of the word gender and that's fine.
Nah, the meaning didn't change. We just realised gender and sex don't always align. Gender was never about genitals
Jeremy Falcon wrote: o me, saying otherwise demeans women and the female experience. It's an insult to women to say peeing in women's bathrooms is all it takes to be a woman.
No one is saying that either. Every right wing argument is predicated on things the left never said
Jeremy Falcon wrote: These days apparently, it's the dudes who have never had a masculine influence (not Andrew Tate ) who envy not having a peepee.
It's also interesting the right are obsessed with trans women and seem to have no clue trans men exist
|
|
|
|
|
Christian Graus wrote: I hate Trump for things he said and did. The crimes that are documented are secondary. Also, the things his fans say and do, the worst people on earth
Now you're just preaching Christain. You just blazed right over my point. Come on man, be smarter. This is the same nonsense average people do on CP.
Christian Graus wrote: We are doing nothing permanent to kids
Mentally you are.
Christian Graus wrote: Then you disagree with being kind to people. No other way to say it
And if I really believed I was a tree and you refused to go along with it? Why do you reject this concept? Think about it Christain. You're saying what you think is right and nobody else can have another thought. How is that not fascist?
Christian Graus wrote: Nah, the meaning didn't change. We just realised gender and sex don't always align. Gender was never about genitals
Do better than this. Words change all the time. "Gay" used to be mean happy. Come one man, you're making this a FB chat. You say you want to learn, but this isn't learning - it's arguing and a waste of time.
Christian Graus wrote: No one is saying that either. Every right wing argument is predicated on things the left never said
No, you just expect me to pretend they're the other sex and insult me if I don't. This the problem with people that argue, they never look inward.
Christian Graus wrote: It's also interesting the right are obsessed with trans women and seem to have no clue trans men exist
Not as much. Do the research.
Really Christian, I know you're the type to not stop arguing. I used to be, so I get it. But, I'm at that point in life where I simply don't care to entertain nonsense anymore. This conversation should be beneath us. Do better.
Jeremy Falcon
|
|
|
|
|
Jeremy Falcon wrote: Now you're just preaching Christain.
No. Trump encouraged hate for minorities, law and order, facts and society. That's why I hate him
Jeremy Falcon wrote: Mentally you are.
The fact is some people are born trans. Biologists agree this is true. What are we doing? Telling the truth? You're just scared that we're encouraging kids to be who they are and not conform blindly to a fake gender binary
Jeremy Falcon wrote: And if I really believed I was a tree and you refused to go along with it? Why do you reject this concept? Think about it Christain. You're saying what you think is right and nobody else can have another thought. How is that not fascist?
The facts are, some people know they are trans. There is no way to make them not trans. Going out of your way to upset them because they confuse you won't make them not trans. It just makes you a jerk. If someone tells me they like to be called a nickname, I call them that. how is this different?
Humans have genders. Humans are not trees
It's fascinating that right wing people have no clue what fascism is. The dictionary defines fascism. Trump is a fascist. Asking you to be kind to people is not fascism
Jeremy Falcon wrote: You say you want to learn, but this isn't learning - it's arguing and a waste of time.
We have always talked about gender roles. I have not had gender with your mum. Sex always meant your parts and gender meant your percieved role in society . This is just a fact. WE didn't change the words, we realised that sex and gender don't always align
Jeremy Falcon wrote: No, you just expect me to pretend they're the other sex and insult me if I don't. This the problem with people that argue, they never look inward.
Every right wing argument is predicated on the idea I tell children to change gender, or want porn in schools, or whatever. IT's always a lie. GEnder is your sense of self. If someone says their sense is female, you can't prove them wrong. Pronouns are a sound you make with your mouth. If you deliberately make the sound that upsets people, you're just a jerk
Jeremy Falcon wrote: Not as much. Do the research.
The way that people become trans in the women makes that seem likely. Irrelevant. I've seen right wing people insist that trans is all men trying to get into women's bathrooms and that trans men don't exist. They really think that
Jeremy Falcon wrote: But, I'm at that point in life where I simply don't care to entertain nonsense anymore.
My core value isn't politics, it's kindness. You're insisting your ignorance of science gives you the right to be kind to people.
I get that right wing people are uneducated enough to have no clue that trans people always existed. I get that the right wing is based on conformity, making all of life the same so it's not confusing. But you're abusing children and I won't stand by
|
|
|
|
|
I'm done with this chat, Christian. I expected more from you. I was wrong.
Jeremy Falcon
|
|
|
|
|
You are saying you expected me to not have morals, and support your feelings over the idea of being kind to children. I'm sorry you thought that
You thought I can't read and don't know what Fascism is? I'm sorry you thought that
You thought I reject science to have feelings because trans people are weird? I'm sorry you thought that
|
|
|
|
|
Not yet, but I'm about to. Pr0n sites are far more entertaining anyway, and occasionally educational. 
Will Rogers never met me.
|
|
|
|
|
LOL!! My wife pushed me into an open marriage and after that, I still don't mind s3x but I'm not super motivated by it
|
|
|
|
|
Roger Wright wrote: Pr0n sites are far more entertaining anyway, and occasionally educational
LMAO
You mean, at your age, there's still things you haven't tried? 
But then, I suppose no matter who you are, there's always someone crazier.
|
|
|
|
|
Yes, I pulled out of Farcebook about 4 years ago. I've never seen the point of Twitter, what a waste of everyone's time!
|
|
|
|
|
I deleted my Twitter account in early 2021 (or late 2020?). Never had Facebook, but had Instagram - deleted it at the same time. (Facebook does too much tracking, hence the Insta deletion.)
I have a Tumblr account where I keep a number of quotes I’ve liked over the years.
Can’t say I like the energy many people give off on those platforms. While there are some good ideas and thoughts put out there, there’s just too much idiocy and anger.
Time is the differentiation of eternity devised by man to measure the passage of human events.
- Manly P. Hall
Mark
Just another cog in the wheel
|
|
|
|
|
Tribel.com seems to be mainly left wing, fwiw.
I'm enjoying mastodon a lot, but picking a home server aligned to one of your interests can be important. If you go with one of the huge servers your local feed will be plastered with lots of things you aren't interested in. You can join several servers for different interests, and transfer your account if you find one you like more.
I'm still on fb for a couple groups, and friends that are still on there, but mastodon is an entirely different world. No algorithm pushing ads and clickbait, no romance scam friend requests. People tend to have interesting discussions instead of just posting memes.
Another thing to look at is the moderation policy on different servers. The good news is that you're likely to be dealing with a real human instead of an idiot algorithm.
|
|
|
|
|
I tried mastodon. There's no conflict but it's just not interesting. I have a few friends I've stuck with between accounts who post interesting things and drive good discussion. I don't see how you can avoid romance scams unless you just never make public posts.
|
|
|
|
|
I haven't exactly quit twitter/X or Facebook but I have gone back to using as I saw them in the beginning.
Facebook is a modernish phonebook.
Twitter/X is little more than a broadcasted SMS service.
So, if people truly want to communicate with me, there's always a way to ask for my phone number in person, and you have the option of calling, texting or setting up a one to one meeting at a cafe for a serious discussion (or facetime me if you're more than 600 km away by land)
As for news...I have a wealth of online newspapers at my disposal.
|
|
|
|
|
|
I used to be active on NetNews (aka. Usenet). I didn't give it up; it was more like NetNews itself gave up ... I read a while ago about someone trying to bring it back to life, but I doubt that they will succeed.
In my youth, several of my friends (and myself) used the mail service - the original, dead trees based one - to exchange opinions, telling about our activities and such, photocopied to all the others. That died out, too. I think I was the last one to mail out anything to the group, but as the reactions ceased, or I got a two-line private (not to the group) response to a three page letter, I quit.
When dead tree mail was replaced with email, we used mailing lists within a few social groups for a few more years. We had increasing problems with some group members knowing nothing about the things we were discussing, invitation to meatings and such. When we ran into those 'deaf' ones (which were increasing in numbers) and asked, the common response was 'I almost never open my email any more - could you rather send me an SMS?'
Of course some wanted us to use FB. One of my work mates felt such responsibility for my 'social' life that since I was not on FB, he all the time tried to bring me into the real life, dragging med over to his screen to show me all his new FB postings, and the comments from all his friends.
Years ago, people tried to drag me into Second Life. I was somewhat fascinated by their technology: Considering the typical internet line speeds at the time, they managed to create an graphic, interactive UI of impressing quality. The 'social' aspects failed to fascinate me to any significant degree. As far as I know, SL still exists, but I never got around to joining it.
Now, FB seems to be on the decline; I would be coming too late to the party. Over the years, there has been a constant flow of reports of censorship, political manipulation and spying on everybody's private lives that has kept me at a distance.
I honestly haven't been attracted to any 'social', public net forum since the days of NetNews. My main reason for following CP is to pick up programming and computer info. I do recognize the signatures of several of the active posters, but I do not consider The Lounge a place for meeting 'friends' in any way that resembles meeting real friends in real, physical life.
|
|
|
|
|
My wife threw me out a few years ago. We're together but don't live together. I'm in a band and that's it. I'd prefer more IRL connection but it's not there
Usenet? I was active there in the 90s
|
|
|
|
|
|
This might be fun.
Like an anecdote in a live TV show many years ago in Spain. One of the guests (important writer and owner of one of the letters of the "Real academia de la lengua española") was closing the eyes and balancing the head, the moderator tried to tease him...
- Moderator: Mr. Cela, are you sleeping?
- Guest: No, I was "slept" **
** correct traduction would be asleep, but in spanish we use the same word "dormido" for both the adjective and the perfect tense
- Moderator: Are they not the same?
- Guest: Of course not, is it for you "to be fvcking" the same as "to be fvcked"?
- Moderator: (idiotic face and no words)
M.D.V. 
If something has a solution... Why do we have to worry about?. If it has no solution... For what reason do we have to worry about?
Help me to understand what I'm saying, and I'll explain it better to you
Rating helpful answers is nice, but saying thanks can be even nicer.
|
|
|
|
|
Do you have your potato? 
Freedom is the freedom to say that two plus two make four. If that is granted, all else follows.
-- 6079 Smith W.
|
|
|
|
|
General 
News 
Suggestion 
Question 
Bug 
Answer 
Joke 
Praise 
Rant 
Admin 
Submit an article or tip
