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chriselst wrote: people rarely get managerial jobs because they have good managerial skills This is true, but they can be trained to be decent at it. Surely companies see the link between poor management and employee defection, and understand how much it costs to replace an employee, yet don't try to do anything about it.
I was about to say I found that surprising until I realized there's a really simple explanation.. corporations are just ape society -- you don't help your inferiors become better because they might usurp you.
We can program with only 1's, but if all you've got are zeros, you've got nothing.
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Yep. A previous place I worked they actually provided a year long management training course for a selected number of employees each year. Unfortunately once completed nothing much changed unless the manager in question took note and changed what they did, if they didn't then they were allowed to carry on as before. It was going on the course that made me acutely aware of how poor those above me were and resolved me to want to leave.
In another job I had a very strong manager, he left frustrated by the inaction of those above him. They replaced him with the two longest serving developers, neither of whom were managers although one I think could be given the right support. I firmly believe this decision was taken because those making the decision were worried about the prospect of another strong person coming in and applying more pressure on them.
Some men are born mediocre, some men achieve mediocrity, and some men have mediocrity thrust upon them.
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I voted for money, but the root cause was ultimately management. In the private sector, salaries are a very sensitive issue. Many companies, including the one I left had a (draconian) policy which strictly forbid sharing your salary with penalty of death termination.
Companies like this typically have a salary range which is also kept secret for a particular position, so it is difficult to tell how your pay relates to your peers.
In these companies, they also don't promote and/or give salary increases automatically. The management claims this is based on merit, but more often it is based on some kind of whimsical decision such as how much they like you instead of evaluating the kind of work you produce.
I myself, was in a bad situation where my peers were getting promoted over me (even though I have been there longer) and given bigger raises because of a perceived notion that they were somehow better programmers (which they weren't). It soon became clear that the situation would not improve, so I found another position which pays more than any of them.
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You needed them or management needed them?
cheers
Chris Maunder
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Next, will it be, "why will you leave your current position?". I'm not sure if comparing the two results will be anything interesting. I kind of expect there to be some correlation, I think.
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Laid off because they didn't win the contract renewal. I was planning on quitting before that (2009), but the market was dead.
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Where I am today because the Army told us they didn't have the money to continue funding the system we were maintaining.
Wish I could watch them go from a computerized inventory system back to pen and paper. That would have been funny.
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I did about 4-5 years of manual labor, factory work, catering, whatnot between the time I graduated to the time I got my IT job.
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working 80hrs a week and stressed out with no support from the boss and offered a new job with 35hrs a week and 10k more and hugely better benefits you bet I left.
If the management would have been handling the stressers in the job would I have been looking? Probably not. So the money was nice but the reason for looking was management. In almost all my moves to new jobs the motivating factor has always been management.
To err is human to really mess up you need a computer
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There can allways be a better job elsewere!
"I have not failed. I've just found 10,000 ways that won't work." Thomas A. Edison
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I was working as a contractor. My partner was hired in to a full-time slot, and six months later so was I. 24 years later, I'm still here.
Software Zen: delete this;
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Gary Wheeler wrote: 24 years later, I'm still here.
WOW! That's impressive!
--
"My software never has bugs. It just develops random features."
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Thanks. To quote a line, what a long strange trip it's been .
Software Zen: delete this;
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Only 24 years?
Rookie!
I'm at 35.9 years!
A positive attitude may not solve every problem, but it will annoy enough people to be worth the effort.
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<Bowing, with hands over head>
We're not worthy! We're not worthy!
</Bowing, with hands over head>
Matt T Heffron wrote: A positive attitude may not solve every problem, but it will annoy enough people to be worth the effort. I'm going to have to try that. Lord knows the current whinging and complaining doesn't seem to help .
Software Zen: delete this;
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Its True for every one "No money no work"
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There are mutiplichoices at real.
For example Money+Stagnation or Location+Downsizing.
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But if/when I change next time I want to fill in multiple choices.
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My last paid position was in Over The Road trucking with serious pressure to run outlaw, tired, and for not much money. Finding the Old - Black - Obese disease an impediment to returning to a paid IT developer/support occupation.
Old = ~50 years old
Black = Race, can be any ethnic minority
Obese= Body Mass Index well over 30
Free your mind and the rest will follow,
Don't be colorblind, don't be so shallow!
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This so-called "survey is missing a vital option:-
The person who has ALWAYS been their own employer!
(And therefore the question makes zero sense)
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Excellent point - there are many people who run their own micro-software vendor shops.
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........
Peter Wasser
"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts." - Bertrand Russell
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Promoted to a job which was outside my skills (too much pointless politics), so moved sideways to a job of my design and interest.
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For me, I would've checked everything except for getting fired.
I would also add the commute since the company moved to some crappy office building in the middle of nowhere because they were too cheap to rent a real building.
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