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Ah yes, I just remembered: <u>L</u>ots of <u>I</u>nsipid <u>S</u>tupid <u>P</u>arentheses.
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I've downloaded Lisp a couple of times in the past and started to work with it and learn and after about 2 days I think what the hell would I do with it?
I've started to get into Python and want to learn it to run on Raspberry Pi or Beaglebone Black if I can ever get it unbricked.
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Mike Hankey wrote: Beaglebone Black if I can ever get it unbricked
Ouch! I must have missed that one - how did you brick it?
Those who fail to learn history are doomed to repeat it. --- George Santayana (December 16, 1863 – September 26, 1952)
Those who fail to clear history are doomed to explain it. --- OriginalGriff (February 24, 1959 – ∞)
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Evidently it's something that happens sooner or later, it's an experimenters board you just reflash it or boot from from uSD and your back in business. That's the selling point.
Well I'm learning Liunx and BBB so I tried for a couple of days to get an image to boot from uSD=>No luck.
So in my wiseness I think why don't I try to backup the image to the uSD, because I can mount and R/W to/from the uSD so I do a linux dd command but I got the source/destination backwards so I overwrote part of my image and when I reboot can no longer ssh into BBB.
So I thought no problem I'll just reflash it...wah thanks for playing!
So it seems the BBB is not as stable a platform as they say it is.
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Oooo...nasty.
Did they just laugh when you told them, or are they going to do something?
(This is why I may be old-fashioned, but I like a minimum boot loader in EPROM rather than flash...)
Those who fail to learn history are doomed to repeat it. --- George Santayana (December 16, 1863 – September 26, 1952)
Those who fail to clear history are doomed to explain it. --- OriginalGriff (February 24, 1959 – ∞)
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I wrote a long pleading email for information and told them when I tried to flash with the uSD in the slot none of the lights came on and they wrote me back asking if the same thing happened without the uSD and I wrote back yes and the last I heard, but to be fair I answered on Thursday so they may not have had time to answer. But quite frankly I don't expect them to do anything about it.
So I should have went with my original choice and got a Pi, which I have since ordered. From all the research I've done since the bricking it seems like the Pi will be a little more Mike proof. 
I did find a post that someone had done the exact same thing and it seems that if you overwrite upper memory that is where some of the bootloader resides and so you have to use a serial device and go in and manually tell the it to boot from the uSD??? I haven't tried yet am waiting for Adafruit to get back to me plus not sure if my USB to serial card will work at 3.3V? Right now it's a software/firmware problem I don't want to compound the problem.
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Serial (well, RS232) is a nominal +12V/-12V, so there will be a USART or similar converter to switch from the internal +3.3V/0V the device uses so there shouldn't be a hardware problem. I'd leave it until the manufacturers had had a good chance to answer before playing myself though. You could make it worse! 
If it makes you feel better, I have a bricked Linksys Media Hub with 1TB HDD sitting on a shelf gathering dust, so it's not just experimental devices that do it. 
Those who fail to learn history are doomed to repeat it. --- George Santayana (December 16, 1863 – September 26, 1952)
Those who fail to clear history are doomed to explain it. --- OriginalGriff (February 24, 1959 – ∞)
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OriginalGriff wrote: Serial (well, RS232) is a nominal +12V/-12V, so there will be a USART or similar converter to switch from the internal +3.3V/0V the device uses so there shouldn't be a hardware problem. I'd leave it until the manufacturers had had a good chance to answer before playing myself though. You could make it worse!
Thanks that's kinda what I thought but as you say I want to wait for the distributor to get back to me.
OriginalGriff wrote: If it makes you feel better, I have a bricked Linksys Media Hub with 1TB HDD sitting on a shelf gathering dust, so it's not just experimental devices that do it.
I had a couple of XBee modules that did the same thing, hadn't used them for a couple of years???
I tend to push things to the limit so it doesn't surprise me that I bricked the BBB, it's a new device and not as stable as the Pi. I knew that going in but thought it a better choice because of the added I/O and such. Sh*t happens!
On a lighter note, I'm taking a class on embedded systems and they require a $13 32-bit ARM development board[^] for use in the class and when I got it and started working with it I really like it and may use it on my rover instead of the AVR boards I was going to use. Very impressive!
The only downside to arm development is the price of the IDEs...whew! Guess I'll be using Eclipse!
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I like ARM as a processor (and they are a nice company to speak to as well) - I used ARM7/ARM9 ten or so years ago in assembler and Embedded C++ and was very impressed. But...the software developer kit costs were ridiculous at around $7500 per user back then! 
Nowadays you can (in theory) target VS2012 at ARM and it should compile C++, but I have no idea about libraries and so forth for a bare-bones system. I'll admit that Eclipse is one of the things that has put me off learning Android development!
Those who fail to learn history are doomed to repeat it. --- George Santayana (December 16, 1863 – September 26, 1952)
Those who fail to clear history are doomed to explain it. --- OriginalGriff (February 24, 1959 – ∞)
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I'm using a lite version of uVision that limits code size to 32K which is not to bad but it's ~$2800 based on the Eclipse IDE and I'll admit it's a good system but the editor sucks.
When I first started doing embedded I looked at using Eclipse and got feed up after a couple of days of trying to get the debugger to work that I gave up. But when I got the BBB and installed the ARM plugin I was a lot more impressed with it.
So it's either;
1) Live with the 32K lite version of uVision
2) Gulp...Learn to use Eclipse
3) Sell an appendage, I'd have to check on this one thou I think the ex got dibs on them in divorce.
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Mike Hankey wrote: I think the ex got dibs on them in divorce
Count your kidneys!
Those who fail to learn history are doomed to repeat it. --- George Santayana (December 16, 1863 – September 26, 1952)
Those who fail to clear history are doomed to explain it. --- OriginalGriff (February 24, 1959 – ∞)
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+1 for eclipse putting you off Android development, it looks and feels like a home brewed effort of the seventies.
We can’t stop here, this is bat country - Hunter S Thompson RIP
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Maybe http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LISP[^]is what ALL here, discussing LISP should read to gain a comon understaning ground AND understand LISP in the larg. i.e Autocad as a CAD systems was able to use LISP, and I (even as a Autocad novice) was able to code new CAD parameterised drawing elements. Not so bad for me 20 years ago. Josef
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Mike Hankey wrote: after about 2 days I think what the hell would I do with it?
That is what has stopped me so far, what can I do with it?
Sorry to hear your beagle is sick.
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JimmyRopes wrote: Sorry to hear your beagle is sick.
Thanks don't know yet whether on critical list but doesn't matter...sh*t happens!
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Mike Hankey wrote: sh*t happens
That is the nature of experimental development.
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JimmyRopes wrote: That is the nature of experimental development.
Yes it is. Over the years I've done a lot of R&D and when it works it's awesome but when it don't...
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In answer to the question, I don't programme with Lisp; I would need a very good reason to start, curiosity in this case would not by itself justify the investment of time and effort.
Whereas other languages such as Python are commercial, hobbyist, free and fun to learn, which is probably why they succeed.
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Simon O'Riordan from UK wrote: I don't programme with Lisp; I would need a very good reason to start
Me too. That is why I am asking if anyone uses it and for what.
Simon O'Riordan from UK wrote: curiosity in this case would not by itself justify the investment of time and effort.
Ditto
Simon O'Riordan from UK wrote: Whereas other languages such as Python are commercial, hobbyist, free and fun to learn, which is probably why they succeed.
I've thought about looking into Python but just haven't had the time.
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Does AutoCAD still use it as its scripting language? I know it used to but I haven't used it in over 20 years.
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Thanks for the information.
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In the 80s, I worked on an NLP parser (for a small subset of English) in Lisp at DEC's AI Technology center in Hudson, MA. Its purpose was to translate a natural language English query into input to drive XCON (at the time, the world's largest expert system). When I moved to XCON, I used OPS5 to write production rules. Lisp was deemed inefficient for that purpose because OPS5's pattern matching algoritm algorithm was much faster than evaluating a Lisp function.
I don't know where Lisp is used nowadays - apart from Emacs macros.
/ravi
modified 1-Feb-14 23:14pm.
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