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Vasudevan Deepak Kumar wrote: e: Monday, June 9, 2008 5:39 AM
Windows should be the most wisely chosen and preferred platform for many at least for the sake of friendlier and rapid application development.
In the .NET/Microsoft C++ world, yes. In other worlds, no. Lot of Java server devs out there and Windows is not an automatic choice. Lots of web-devs out there not using ASP.NET and Windows is actually a pretty poor web-dev platform.
regards,
Paul Watson
Ireland & South Africa
Fernando A. Gomez F. wrote: At least he achieved immortality for a few years.
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Nope......Don't Think So.....!
I usually do not repond to "absolutes" like this, however I will trhow in my two(2) cents worth.
Windows SHOULD NOT be the preferred platform for application development. Perhaps in my 25-years or so in IT as a developer, COBOL, C and C++, something seems gets lost in the translation when you go to the .NET Platform. Now, before the angry mob "storms the castle", here are some observations:
1. A basic understanding, more times that not, is lost of how "that-really-cool-GUI" impacts on the application as a whole. Many a time, and in my personal experience
2. .NET is cool, no doubt about it, but why do I need an IDE that "tells" me what my SYNTAX errors are, gives me options to variable types,16 gazillion different development panes/windows,status bars, this gizmo, that gizmo, et.al? As an old-timer  , Just let me open a window, and type in my code via my favorite editor (Vi, of course...) and have at it.
3. Compiling your source code, should not encompass "hitting-the-widget" at the top of your screen. Most developers I have known, ENJOY typing in the "command line syntax", watching the compiler initiate, and then getting lines of SYNTAX, UNDEFINES and the such. We are Developers, that is what we do. We want to search, seek and look for the reasons we got a Sementation Fault, or Bus Error, or SOC7. I don't want you to tell me all that and other, sometimes useless information in those "pretty little windows". 
3. .NET is NOT what you want to use to replace your "LEGACY" systems. Ask the Insurance and Banking Industries. You will notice that they are STILL using the IBM/AIX/UNIX Platforms. You need to understand these systems are huge and STILL work very well. If I was a CIO, and someone started the notion of migrating our 1-million plus lines of LEAGACY application software to VB.NET or something similar, after being unconscious for several hours , I would have to probably have to engage in some type of theraputic treatment for a significant amount of time  .
Now, with all that being said, .NET is GOOD for architectures already based on a Microsoft Platform. I will not argue that case. The scalability, tools, gizmos all work together very well.
But you need to understand, .NET is NOT the "end-all-be-all", and IT needs to understand that. We just cannot afford to always jump on the "flavor-of-the-day" because it is the next best thing.
In closing, here are a few "interesting" if not provocative comments I experienced recently:
"... COBOL is outdated and will never be used today..."
"... No one uses UNIX..."
"... What the heck are you using Vi for...?"
My reponse to them, to coin a phrase, "...In time Young Jedi.....In time....."
".... We will add your biological and technological distinctiveness to our own . . . . Resistance is Futile . . . . You will be Assimilated . . . . . ."
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kxh29 wrote: Just let me open a window, and type in my code via my favorite editor
<blockquote class="FQ"><div class="FQA">kxh29 wrote:</div>"command line syntax", watching the compiler initiate</blockquote>
Yep, unless I'm doing something with WinForms I use EDIT and compile at the command line.
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that's B.S. -- only because ms dumbs everything down
it's the mcdonald's drive-through mentality...have to have it quick and easy without any thinking or effort on the user's part... that's why ms products all have that code-completion junk.
people including some software engineers are going to look like potatoes soon -- with small heads and big fat bodies... from intellectual laziness!
David
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Well....in a manner of speaking.....
You are absolutely correct. Quick, fast and easy. This is NOT the normal
psyche of most Software Application/Software Development Engineers.
I would really shudder, if our brethern at Rayethon or Grumman were tasked to create their
Missle Guidance Systems using a Microsoft Platform.
Or for that matter, the Fighter Pilot or Attack Pilot when they pull the trigger, they recieve a
404 Error - You are not Authorized to View this Screen.... 
".... We will add your biological and technological distinctiveness to our own . . . . Resistance is Futile . . . . You will be Assimilated . . . . . ."
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Well, well,... I saw some people coding in notepad and compiling via batch file. So they still exist
I program on laptop at home. And so I code with my mouse and Ctrl^C/Ctrl^V (several keyboards a day do not let you subconsiously use easier key combinations - at least Control keys are located at the same spot). It means that I use code completion all the time.
And when I switch to Java, NetBeans would not finish this line for me:
MyLongClass<String key, List<Object>> var = new
... so there, my coding is 10% slower.
Etkins, will you just type it with 10 fingers faster than with a mouse click? Profy 
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I am not sure I understand your comment.
f- notepad... I code using vi. Folks who are adept at using vi enjoy keeping their hands on the keyboard, and thus using the mouse becomes an annoyance. In fact, some might argue that the mouse will then cause productivity losses, because you have to stop typing to reach for the mouse 
David
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assuming you have to use a mouse to utilize code completion or features common to modern day IDE's (which is false).
I personally hate vi because of the learning curve (which I never got over cause I had access to better editors that did more for me). I was forced to use it in school, but with the advance of the ever present graphical user interface thats present on modern computers these days I can't see why anyone would want to continue to use it (or emacs) over an integrated development environment.
only elitist and old programmers (who fail to keep up with life) would take the stance that a terminal based editor (that requires you to type everything out by hand) is better than something with hundreds of productivity features at their disposal. which one are you?
then again, if given the choice of coding the same exact data structures from scratch on every single project, or coding the implementation of some really cool application, I'd choose to implement the really cool features, rather than spending all my time writing the same old mundane crap. Guess some folks like doing the mundane things because 1. they know how, and 2. others (wisely) don't, so it makes them somehow feel "elite."
that reminds me a lot of the child's book the emperor's new clothes in that he thinks he's running around looking cool when in fact he is just naked.
to enjoy the way you write code is one thing. using vi isn't wrong or right, its just what you prefer. using kdevelop, visual studio, eclipse, or qt's editor isn't wrong or right either, its just what other people prefer.
spewing ignorant statements like "<entity> sucks because <reason>" just proves the intelligence with which you chose to form your opinions and has the opposite effect that you were intending.
modified on Tuesday, June 10, 2008 6:45 PM
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two-fold:
productivity (depending upon how you want to measure it) -- using vi, merely keeps your fingers on the keyboard...one would think where you want them, i.e. typing code.
the second point about code completion: i understand your point about avoiding the need to type the same text over and over again, but one may miss the understanding of "what goes on under the hood" with respect to the code *you* never have to type, i.e, do you really know what that code represents, how it works, and what the impact it has on the performance of your application.
that's the only two points i was making...
kind regards,
David
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I cannot
etkins wrote: enjoy keeping their hands on the keyboard
because it is a laptop, and one of several, and they all have different keys layout.
If I have no mouse at my disposal, then I have to use the touchpad, and so I switch to using keyboard only.
We code in different worlds 
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