|
What about ... NEVER ... I would kill myself first!
|
|
|
|
|
Do you feel it that terrible?
Vasudevan Deepak Kumar
Personal Homepage
Tech Gossips
Yesterday is a canceled check. Tomorrow is a promissory note. Today is the ready cash. USE IT.
|
|
|
|
|
Yes. It’s not the hardware itself, but it’s the difficulty of upgrading it. Apple has a "Do no wrong" perception right now, but if ANY other company tried to tell you, "In order to run our OS, you MUST buy our hardware, and when you want to upgrade, you MUST buy it from us"... well, it wouldn't be well received.
I might not kill myself, but I would give myself a good maiming.
My code has no bugs, just undocumented features.
|
|
|
|
|
I have been using and developing software on PCs for a long time, ~20 years. I always build my own desktop PCs, and I went into this Apple thing expecting to not be impressed.
It all started about 4 months ago I was in need of a laptop. I ended up buying a 15" Macbook Pro (2.2GHz dual core, 2GB, 160GB). I figured I could just install Windows on it if I didn't like OS X.
Let me say I was impressed from the start. I turned the thing on, and all I had to do was enter my wireless security settings. This thing just works like you expect it to. It has a very solid build and lots of small touches that really add up. My old Dell Inspiron feeks like it was built out a Legos by a 3rd grader
After using the Macbook for a few months I really like it a lot. I am running Vista Ultimate in a VM using VMWare Fusion. The performance is very good, Vista running in the VM scores better on the CPU, memory, and hard drive tests than on my AMD dual core 4400+, 4GB, ASUS MB, and SATA 3.0 controller.
After such a great experience with the laptop I began looking into replacing my desktop (the AMD 4400+ mentioned above) that was running Vista Ultimate with a Mac Pro.
When I bought the laptop I got it new from Apple, but I wanted to save a little money on the Mac Pro. I ended up buying a open box Mac Pro from www.macmall.com for about $700 less than a new one. It arrived in perfect condition.
My Mac Pro is a 2.66GHz Xeon quad core with 10GB RAM. Let me tell you it is really nice to be able to install 10GB (or 4GB for that matter) of RAM, and the OS can actually see and use it. I had lots of problems getting XP and Vista to see my 4GB even when the MB supported it.
I am runnig XP Pro using VMWare Fusion, and you can't even tell it's a VM. I run all the software I ran on my PC (SQL 2005, Visual Studio, Paint.NET, etc) with no problems and excellent performance. VMWare Fusion even puts Windows application windows right on your OS X desktop just lik native OS X apps. Very cool.
Also, OS X has been great. Neither the laptop or the desktop have ever crashed or thrown a single error in months of use. Windows even seems to run better in the VM than on real hardware. Might be somthing to do with the VMWare driver quality.
I upgraded to Leopard (OS X 10.5) about a week ago, and it is working fine so far.
Bottom line is that I was skeptical at first, but after actually using Apple hardware and OS X I am completely sold. Sure, I still need to develop software on Windows because that's where the money is, but I have found that for anything else I prefer to use OS X. It is much better than XP or Vista IMO.
If you are thinking about trying a Mac I say definitely give it a shot. Once you actually experience it there are tons of small touches that you just can't appreciate on a technical spec sheet. They are well worth the price.
Now I understand that what I like not everyone else will, but you will never know until you try it.
-- modified at 11:52 Thursday 15th November, 2007
|
|
|
|
|
You did not buy a Mac, you bought an over priced PC, with the Mac OS.
Schneider
|
|
|
|
|
Call it what you will, but I am happy with it. That's all that matters. 
The only software I run under the Windows VM is development tools. Everything else I run in OS X.
|
|
|
|
|
I think I have to disagree that Apple computers come in a better package and have the same CPU's. My systems always have top-notch, bleeding-edge hardware that surpasses Apples, for considerably less. My computers externals look at worst just as good, and at best far better (imo), than an Apple Macintosh. If you boil it down to an apples-to-apples comparison of hardware, looks, os, and cost, PC will win hands down every time because they cost so much less, and still have a great OS. Brushed metal cases? Sure, easy to come by, and in a hundred different varieties to meet each persons individual preferences (vs. the SINGLE option you get with Apple). Simplicity and elegance of design? There are ten million different kinds keyboards, mice, monitors, speakers, and cases of all different sizes, shapes, colors, textures, and qualities that each individual can choose from to build the computer that fits THEIR preferences of simplicty and design. Sure, Apple stuff looks good, but there is only one flavor.
I'll grant, Mac OS X looks cool, its clean and simple. Leopard has a really cool, snazzy new look that I would say isn't quite as clean, but certainly more interesting than previous versions of OS X. It has some pretty cool featuers too, some of them taken from Vista, some of them new. Thats the age-old question of who stole from who though, and I don't think anyone knows anymore (however, I have to say, StarDock had gadgets first in the form of DesktopX for Windows...long before Yahoo, Apple, or anyone else...LONG before). But you have to ask yourself, whats more important in an operating system if your a developer? Glossy shine and fancy gadgetry in the abscence of flexability and function, or flexability and function with a little less shine? I'll take Windows with my Visual Studio, SQL Server, IIS, .NET, C#, etc. etc. over OS X any day.
OS X is an operating system with fancy stuff for fancy people...Windows is a whole platform with cool stuff for cool developers. 
|
|
|
|
|
|
Thanks for the compliments Jeff. I really need to finish that series too...the third article has been left hanging, as I've been sick for about 3 months. :\ I hope to wrap it up soon!! 
|
|
|
|
|
I think we could proove the point about looks on PC rivaling or surpassing that of Apples, too. Anyone got a photo of their sweet PC setup? If so, link it!!
|
|
|
|
|
But that is not a no permanently. Yes I would buy a Mac, or Linux, or BSD Unix, providing it allowed full GPU and other hardware support under Virtual environments. That is finally starting to happen, but it is young. Hypervisor direct control of hardware from within a virtual environment is a big change. GPU is just now starting, but it would have to go well beyond just the GPU to Physics processors, A to D converters, and others. As long as the speed is there, and direct hardware support within the virtual environments you can choose what ever you like, or can afford, etc. Apple would not be precluded, and never has been precluded for my line of work, other than the fact that I do so much with a variety of hardware that I can't be held back by either the platform nor the virtual environment on the platform.
To me the ultimate machine would be one where I can choose what hardware is visible on the virtual environment, building many test-machines for customer equipment. Then I can have one fully loaded machine that looks like many smaller machines with a variety of customer choice Operating systems.
_________________________
Asu no koto o ieba, tenjo de nezumi ga warau.
Talk about things of tomorrow and the mice in the ceiling laugh. (Japanese Proverb)
|
|
|
|
|
That would have been a No, if Macs didn't switch to Intel, and Parallels didn't make it so easy to virtualize Windows on a Mac for my development needs!
I have to admit, Leopard makes Vista look pretty darned silly from my initial impressions! I might be buying a Mac soon... it's really getting too darned tempting
Happy programming!
|
|
|
|
|
If the cost was not so prohibitive, I'd buy a Mac notebook for sure. I mean, why limit yourself ? If the mac can run OSX AND windows, then you get two computers for the price of one.
Christian Graus - Microsoft MVP - C++
"also I don't think "TranslateOneToTwoBillion OneHundredAndFortySevenMillion FourHundredAndEightyThreeThousand SixHundredAndFortySeven()" is a very good choice for a function name" - SpacixOne ( offering help to someone who really needed it ) ( spaces added for the benefit of people running at < 1280x1024 )
|
|
|
|
|
Christian Graus wrote: If the cost was not so prohibitive
I've price compared the Mac PowerBooks to comparably outfitted Dells and the PBs are actually cheaper. I was a little surprised at that. I'm pretty sure the next machine I get will be a PB.
¡El diablo está en mis pantalones! ¡Mire, mire!
Real Mentats use only 100% pure, unfooled around with Sapho Juice(tm)!
SELECT * FROM User WHERE Clue > 0
0 rows returned
Save an Orange - Use the VCF!
VCF Blog
|
|
|
|
|
OK - I was looking for a high end machine and locally, it added about 50%, last time I looked.
Christian Graus - Microsoft MVP - C++
"also I don't think "TranslateOneToTwoBillion OneHundredAndFortySevenMillion FourHundredAndEightyThreeThousand SixHundredAndFortySeven()" is a very good choice for a function name" - SpacixOne ( offering help to someone who really needed it ) ( spaces added for the benefit of people running at < 1280x1024 )
|
|
|
|
|
A desktop machine? Yeah I think that might still be the case, the PowerMac's are pricey. Granted, they are *really* nice machines from a hardware perspective. I have a G4 tower and it's a joy to deal with in terms of access to the hardware - it's much easier to get at all the various components and switch stuff out.
¡El diablo está en mis pantalones! ¡Mire, mire!
Real Mentats use only 100% pure, unfooled around with Sapho Juice(tm)!
SELECT * FROM User WHERE Clue > 0
0 rows returned
Save an Orange - Use the VCF!
VCF Blog
|
|
|
|
|
Two conditions:
1/ The price is the same or less than an equivalently equipped PC
2/ I can code, debug, test, and package a windows app on the mac and it runs on the PC with no issues or problems.
Based on past history, and iJobs cash fixation neither 1 nor 2 will ever realistically happen.
Nothing is impossible, we just don't know the way of it yet.
|
|
|
|
|
Isn't 2 a crazy proposition - NO OS out there lets you do that natively, without resorting to using a VM. Are you aware you can dual boot the Intel based Macs? As well as run Windows from within a VM on OSX?
¡El diablo está en mis pantalones! ¡Mire, mire!
Real Mentats use only 100% pure, unfooled around with Sapho Juice(tm)!
SELECT * FROM User WHERE Clue > 0
0 rows returned
Save an Orange - Use the VCF!
VCF Blog
|
|
|
|
|
Jim Crafton wrote: Isn't 2 a crazy proposition - NO OS out there lets you do that natively, without resorting to using a VM.
My point exactly - I have no desire to spend time I don't have using a mac to write and test applications that will be targeted to the Windows environment (majority of the users).
Jim Crafton wrote: Are you aware you can dual boot the Intel based Macs?
As well as run Windows from within a VM on OSX?
Yes and Yes - so what? Why pay extra for a machine that I have to go through hoops for when for half the price I do it natively?
Jim, It all comes down to what process and tools you feel comfortable about. Lets agree that we differ in our opinion based on past experiences.
Nothing is impossible, we just don't know the way of it yet.
|
|
|
|
|
... I'm still crying for my old machine running... (applause) NT4 SP6.
Oh boy, how that computers works. You didn't had time to grab the coffee and light a cigarette and the logon screen was already there...
Nuclear launch detected
|
|
|
|
|
Same here. Me and a bunch of people I know believe NT4 was the best thing Microsoft ever came up with. Too bad they killed it by not including USB support in any of service packs, forcing us to (needlessly) upgrade to w2k or xp.
--
Vladimir Svrkota,
CardWare
Novi Sad, Serbia.
|
|
|
|
|
USB as USB... but remember NT4 installation at the end?
"Securing file system..." and Administrator ONLY could access the machine and only then grant rights to other.
And how the build was running... better I stop here or I'll throw the actual machine. 
Remember Win2K setup? System drive, security -- Everyone: FULL CONTROL.
XP was even better - first setup your user name (of course, Computer Administrator), connect network etc. Only then "Create a password."
Nuclear launch detected
|
|
|
|
|
Window 2000, was the best after that it all went downhill.
WPF - Imagineers Wanted
Follow your nose using DoubleAnimationUsingPath
|
|
|
|
|
I buy a Mac desktop and put XP or Vista on it, but my future upgrade options are so limited.
With a "standard" PC I can upgrade almost every component.
I guess this isn't as much of an issue for laptop users tho - maybe I'd use a macBook...
|
|
|
|
|
My same reasoning for saying MAYBE - the upgrade options are much more limited.
For example, if I want to go to the new Intel core, I am planning to keep most of the peripherals the same, figuring to change motherboard, CPU and RAM, maybe power supply. I am not sure with the MAC, sometimes they come out with an entirely new form factor, and you have to scrap a lot of equipment.
|
|
|
|
|
General 
News 
Suggestion 
Question 
Bug 
Answer 
Joke 
Praise 
Rant 
Admin 
Submit an article or tip
