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"Mars ain't the kind of place to raise your kids" -- Sir Elton, circa 1972
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This is no news. All is means is that in Mars' current state, people will have to live underground, rather than in domes on the surface. Massive terraforming would be required (starting with a drastic increase to the atmospheric pressure) before humans could live on Mars like we do on Earth.
Freedom is the freedom to say that two plus two make four. If that is granted, all else follows.
-- 6079 Smith W.
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Yeah. We'd be much better off putting those resources into improving our own world.
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How?
Give people money? Study after study has been shown if you give a group of people the same amount of money they'll end up right back where they started.
Build our own world? Mr. Beast tried doing that in places like Africa and pissed the government off because he did something they can't do. The poorest countries are poor for a reason, but nobody wants to say the truth these days.
Save the oceans from plastic? Nobody has invented a plastic replacement. Admittedly, companies should do a better job of at least not spilling it into the ocean. But, no civilian can mandate that.
Human nature is human nature. And humans are far from perfect. We talk about this woo-woo stuff but nobody ever has a plan that'll actually work.
The reality is, nobody wants to clean up their own act or their own bedroom (the Earth). We just wanna complain and wait for someone else to do it. And when the whole world is pointing fingers at everyone else... nothing gets done.
Probably easier to just go to Mars. 
Jeremy Falcon
modified 3-Sep-24 14:47pm.
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Jeremy Falcon wrote: nobody ever has a plan that'll actually work
That's because top-down planning is doomed to failure. Successful economies aren't "planned". They emerge from lots of distributed decision making.
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Amen to that, brother.
Jeremy Falcon
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Jeremy Falcon wrote: And when the whole world is pointing fingers at everyone else... nothing gets done.
Many people just do not realize that, when they point the finger to someone, there are 3 other fingers pointing to themselves.
M.D.V. 
If something has a solution... Why do we have to worry about?. If it has no solution... For what reason do we have to worry about?
Help me to understand what I'm saying, and I'll explain it better to you
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Jeremy Falcon wrote: Probably easier to just go to Mars
Well, the current plans to do that do sound more cohesive than the ones for "saving" this planet.
We do need an offsite backup...
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You are absolutely correct! We shouldn’t do anything to improve this world, because ‘humans are humans,’ as you say. The trillions that will go towards Mars, instead of to improving the conditions for our teachers, so we quit hearing stories about how they are have to pay for stuff out of their own pockets, like copy paper: yeah – that’s exactly the way the world should be, because ‘human nature is human nature.’ Those trillions should go to rocket boosters, and environmental tanks, because creating jobs with it to build ocean ships and other items to remove plastic from the seas, and keep it from getting there in the first place, is a totally pointless endeavor – people are people, and aren’t ‘worth it.’ Only those that ‘have an intellect’ worth getting off the planet are worth saving (or something like that).
Those trillions are so much better spent on sending 100,000 tons of metal and equipment far away, rather than create jobs for people who would like to get our mentally ill people off the street, and start tackling the problem of homelessness that seems to have grown much worse after Reagan basically kicked them out into the streets back in the 80s. After all, they are just people! Who cares!
And all the people in Appalachia, and other regions where the jobs have dried up because corporate america has decided to f*** them: yeah – they deserve that, and we should just keep them ‘down.’ After all, what has a poor person, who used to work the manufacturing lines, ever done for me?
> The reality is, nobody wants to clean up their own act or their own bedroom (the Earth).
So, everyone you know is just as much of a slob as you are. Wow. How comforting!
As you can surmise, this is hugely sarcastic. You are talking out of your ass, saying ‘nobody wants…’
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.David O'Neil wrote: We'd be much better off putting those resources into improving our own world
I would like to remind you that the dinosaurs became extinct because they had no space program. Even if terraforming Mars is prohibitively expensive at the current state of the art, having a self-sufficient outpost on Mars would be a relatively cheap insurance policy for species survival.
Freedom is the freedom to say that two plus two make four. If that is granted, all else follows.
-- 6079 Smith W.
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Daniel Pfeffer wrote: for species survival.
I would say more to "delay the extinction", we will find a way to screw it up as we did here.
M.D.V.
If something has a solution... Why do we have to worry about?. If it has no solution... For what reason do we have to worry about?
Help me to understand what I'm saying, and I'll explain it better to you
Rating helpful answers is nice, but saying thanks can be even nicer.
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But how could the super rich turn that into a pissing contest?
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Daniel Pfeffer wrote: starting with a drastic increase to the atmospheric pressure
Gravity is to low for that.
Carbon dioxide is heavy enough to stay, oxygen, nitrogen and water is not and is therefore slowly disappearing.
That said, Carbon dioxide is also slowly disappearing because the ultraviolet light from the sun is splitting some CO2Wrong is evil and must be defeated. - Jeff Ello
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If you solve the thermodynamical equations for an atmosphere, you will see that at any temperature above 0K all atmospheres "leak". The only question is the half-life of the leaking. If we were, for example, to bring the oxygen pressure of Mars up to that of Earth, the atmosphere would still last for millions of years. For that matter, a similar atmosphere on the Moon would last for approximately 100,000 years.
The issue is how to increase the atmospheric pressure, Mars has quite a lot of oxygen trapped as oxides, so a Von Neuman machine (one which replicates itself from local raw materials) would be able to release much of this bound oxygen in a few centuries - if we knew how to build a Von Neuman machine. Our best bet would probably be to genetically engineer plants to do the job for us. This would also be non-trivial (low current pressure, almost no oxygen, etc.), but would probably be quicker in the long run.
Freedom is the freedom to say that two plus two make four. If that is granted, all else follows.
-- 6079 Smith W.
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Daniel Pfeffer wrote: The issue is how to increase the atmospheric pressure,
call Douglas Quaid  
M.D.V.
If something has a solution... Why do we have to worry about?. If it has no solution... For what reason do we have to worry about?
Help me to understand what I'm saying, and I'll explain it better to you
Rating helpful answers is nice, but saying thanks can be even nicer.
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I only skimmed the page because I do not trust hyperbolic headlines. So, I could be off-base here...
After 2 seconds I saw the word radiation. So, it's worth pointing that not all radiation is created equal with the same half lives, etc. Also, there's nothing saying we can't get rid of what's causing the radiation. Not to mention, realistically humans wouldn't be in the open air anyway to start and we have the technology to filtrate.
You see, everyone says something is impossible before it's actually done by the geniuses of the world. While everyone else just watches and/or complains. I bet if we went back in time, people would say it was impossible to go to the moon. And yet... humans did it.
Again, I only skimmed the article as I'd prefer to see genius-level wording in it before I spend my energy digging into it. Which means I tend to rule out most "newsy" type sites. But, that's just me tired off seeing shock value as a substitute for substance.
Jeremy Falcon
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I agree with you, but I think a stronger adjective is required to describe that site. The site is like the national enquirer for science.
The difficult we do right away...
...the impossible takes slightly longer.
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I noticed that myself (and the other story links) which made doubt the veracity of anything on that site. I also have a minor in Astronomy and have different data on living on Mars. Just don't do naked sunbathing on the surface and you'll be fine! 
- I would love to change the world, but they won’t give me the source code.
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� Forogar � wrote: Just don't do naked sunbathing on the surface and you'll be fine!
Well, there goes my plan. 
Jeremy Falcon
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Voyager 1 turned back to Earth!
Whoever wrote that has proven beyond a shadow of doubt that they are absolute morons and pathetic liars, not to mention that they don't have a clue as to what moves Voyager and how it is powered.
Just Fools 
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Jeremy Falcon wrote: You see, everyone says something is impossible before it's actually done by the geniuses of the world.
Everyone said it was impossible, until someone came that didn't know / hear it and just did it.
M.D.V.
If something has a solution... Why do we have to worry about?. If it has no solution... For what reason do we have to worry about?
Help me to understand what I'm saying, and I'll explain it better to you
Rating helpful answers is nice, but saying thanks can be even nicer.
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You be dropping facts. Every successful person being interviewed I ever watched all said, don't listen to the naysayers. They just wanna bring you down to their level to make themselves feel better about doing nothing.
A successful person will never tell you can't do something. They may tell you it's gonna be hard and know what you're getting into, but they'll never say it's impossible if it's something they've done.
Jeremy Falcon
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